I will go along with Jennifer on this. There is no question that Israel is committing war crimes. I agree that these war crimes can be considered genocide. The point is that we now have a true humanitarian crisis in Gaza. Quibling over semantics at this juncture is a total waste of time. First, solve the crisis. There will be plenty of time to discuss semantics *after* this mess is resolved.
It is not "quibbling over semantics" to call it genocide.
Genocide has a specific legal meaning and allows for specific legal responses.
Understanding that this is genocide means that punishment for those responsible is an obligation under international law.
This will include not just so many in Israeli leadership and its military, but US leaders as well, since the US has been a bipartisan accomplice to this horror.
Quibbling over semantics? Starvation or famine, war crimes or genocide, how we characterize the crisis can determine what steps we take to address it. If we're going to label the crises at all, the labels should be accurate.
Jennifer Rubin and Norm Eisen won't say 'genocide' - here's a small sample of some that do:
Human Rights Organizations:
Amnesty International
Human Rights Watch
University Network for Human Rights
B’Tselem
Physicians for Human Rights - Israel
Genocide Scholars and Experts:
Francesca Albanese, UN special rapporteur on the Occupied Palestinian Territories
Omer Bartov, Israeli-American professor of Holocaust and Genocide Studies at Brown University
Amos Goldberg, Israeli professor in the Department of Jewish History and Contemporary Jewry at the Hebrew University of Jerusalem and a fellow of the Van Leer Jerusalem Institute
Raz Segal, Israeli historian and associate professor of Holocaust and Genocide Studies and endowed professor in the Study of Modern Genocide at Stockton University
Shmuel Lederman, professor specializing in political theory and genocide studies at the Open University of Israel
Martin Shaw, emeritus professor of International Relations and Politics at the University of Sussex, research professor at the Institut Barcelona d'Estudis Internacionals, and author of War and Genocide, What is Genocide, Genocide in International Relations
William Schabas, professor of international law at Middlesex University in the United Kingdom, professor of international human law and human rights at Leiden University in the Netherlands, and author of several books on international law, including Genocide in International Law: The Crimes of Crimes
Dirk Moses, international relations professor at the City College of New York and author of The Problems of Genocide
Daniel Blatman, Israeli historian specializing in the history of the Holocaust and head of the Institute for Contemporary Jewry at the Hebrew University of Jerusalem.
Lee Mordechai, Israeli historian and associate professor at Hebrew University
Melanie O'Brien, president of the International Association of Genocide Scholars
Uğur Ümit Üngör, professor of Genocide Studies at the NIOD Institute for War, Holocaust, and Genocide Studies and the University of Amsterdam
Excellent. Thanks for sending this, Jason. It is just APPALLING that so many Dems and NeverTrumpers have turned a blind eye to the genocide in Gaza. It was awful to see my senator (Schiff) and Klobuchar and Schumer smiling in a photo with Netanyahu last week. They're all complicit in this horror.
Ugh yea, I have mentioned that here several times, so revolting…. And still never referenced The Contrarian. It’s important to note support for Israel’s genocide has been bipartisan all along.
Absolutely. It was Biden's greatest failing, I think. We still can only get 16 or 17 Dems to vote against continued arms. Let's see if we do better this week, with Bernie's latest amendments.
Irrelevant. An eye for an eye makes both parties blind. Bullets have no party or cause, they are indiscriminate killers. It is the intent of those who use these deadly weapons, not of the victims of their aim. Starvation is intentional when food is readily available, but made a commodity of control.
Of course hamas bears responsibility for attacking israel and one must wonder what their motive was, to have all their people slaughtered or starved in response? Was it to derail some negotiations with saudi arabia? It was bold and suicidal.
What is the rationale for israel to continue the non-military actions (starving, decimating civilian housing, etc.)? I have had supporters of idf's action consistently claim that it could all be stopped by hamas surrendering and giving up the hostages. That they have to restrict food because hamas steals it---yet also claim that somehow the Palestinians are collectively responsible for not turning in hamas fighters. It is like local law enforcement holding grandma responsible for allowing her grandson to deal drugs from their house and not turning him in.
Why not follow the money? How about going after the leaders who apparently live in Qatar and elsewhere and have billions in bank accounts. What keeps israel and the US from sanctioning these host nations and banks?
The ultimate concern for US taxpayers is how do we want our money to be used? We are paying for all of this. Just like we paid for the 20 year invasion of Afghanistan because terrorists attacked us.
From what I understand, Netanyahu did something (don't know exactly what) that enabled Hamas to do the October 7 attack. Maybe Netanyahu was looking for an excuse for war, so he could avoid being tried and convicted for other crimes. I have seen multiple places over the time this has been going on, to that effect.
Thank you for finally acknowledging what most of the entire world has been shouting for many months now.
Even though you still won't call it 'genocide', even if every scholar and human rights org everywhere has said so ... even though you still haven't acknowledged that the steadfast bipartisan support from the US has made this possible from the start and both Democrats and Republicans are complicit in these crimes against humanity ... even though you have never acknowledged the apartheid and oppression and violence and terror that Israel has inflicted on the Palestinian people for most of living memory - thank you!
Thank you for finally stating what has been obvious to anyone paying attention for a long time now...you're a superhero!"
"Just yesterday, dozens of rabbis were arrested after protesting in front of Senate Majority Leader John Thune’s office, calling for aid in Gaza."
Do we realize that not one American TV Network reported this protest? It was reported by the Israeli Times, The Jerusalem Post, and many other foreign media. But only MSN seems to have covered it in the US! WHY? This is one of the main issues demonstrating our lack of a free press!
It is an issue that allows Trump and the Republicans to lie to voters. Yet, the Democrats remain silent about this! Is there a committee in the DNC that records this anti democracy and pro-Israel disinformation? Do we have a way established by the Democratic Party to counter such an atrocity, one that could sway the American public away from allowing our country to support the Zionist movement (with the help of our Government) to exterminate the families of Gaza?
We need some from the Democratic Party to organize an opposition to the American TV Networks being taken over by Trump! There needs to be far more concern for this issue that we are seeing!
I agree, and I wrote a comment above where I provided information about the two Israeli rights groups that have labeled it a genocide. That should make a difference. But, it won't matter to Jeffries and Schumer, who received $1.2 M and $1.7 M in 2024 from the American Israeli PAC. ASPAC spent $100 million in the 2024 election buying the votes of Democratic and Republican congresspeople. https://www.aipacpac.org/
Yes. All part of the issue. Who would have thought that the State of Israel could have been taken over by authoritarians? Who would have thought that the Democrats, in addition to the Republicans, would have supported that coup? And in the end, we too, the world's democracy, are a part of the same Coup. But it is not over yet! Schumer, Trump, and Netanyahu all report to the same people. At some point, whether it be Musk, or someone else with that much power, will be rubbed, and when that happens, things can change fast! Hopefully, for the world, that does not take another 40 years!
There IS a purpose to Israeli policy in Gaza and the West Bank: to make them Palestinian-free. Donald Trump and other supporters and enablers of Israeli policy in the United States, as well as those who remain silent, are complicit in the war crimes.
Maybe start with the 7 Senate Democrats that took a smiling fun photo with the indicted war criminal Netanyahu just weeks ago...then look at the many in both the House and Senate who get massive donations from AIPAC.
Then look at the years worth of public statements and actions from Jeffries, Schumer, Booker, so many others, too many to list...
And of course, there was the full support given to Israel as it committed open and obvious war crimes by the Biden administration for 15 months... not to mention its military and financial support well before then, even when Israel assassinated an American journalist, Shireen Abu Akleh, even when Israel bombed and invaded Gaza numerous times before 2023, and continued its apartheid in the West Bank.
There is no controversy about it, it's an objective fact that most, nearly all , elected Democrats have supported Israel's terror for a long time.
Part of the rightwing/authoritarian personality is the need to exact vengeance for real and perceived injuries. What brings them down is that they cannot perceive when enough vengeance has been inflicted... Netanyahu needs to go. The healing can only begin when the hateful autocrat is removed from office.
The US and Israel have repeatedly elected fascist regimes. The hallmark of fascism is perpetrating mass murder without a qualm. Netanyahu and his nazh-gul have no compunction about starving children in their thousands. Indeed, they are obviously gleeful about it. Trump wilfully murdered about 300,000 people during covid and ending USAID will send his kill rate well into the millions. These are not the kind of people who have second thoughts about their atrocities.
Thank you for calling out loud the truth of the horror . It is the worst human to human arrogance by people who know history and yet act as though historic actions give some authority to today’s behavior. Obscene.
It appears that tRump's evangelical base is aligned with the far right in the Israeli government. That would be consistent with a drive to ethnically cleanse all of Gaza and install Israeli settlers. In tRump's rantings there were comments about creating an Eastern Mediterranean resort there.
yes, and "christians" need all Jews back in the holy land for the rapture to occur... what's his face is the ambassador to isrile....his fat daughter was the press sec 1st term of the orange menace. hate being oldish, can't remember shit !
Famine, disease, starvation and death at your doorstep is not an acceptable situation. Unless this situation is remedied then why should the U.S. continue to support Israel? A strong leader would put their foot down. Trump is not that leader. Hoping this ends soon and peacefully.
No, it shouldn't be a linguistic debate. But from Tom Malinowski's July 29th Evening Roundup: "Americans must speak out on the catastrophe in Gaza."
No! Americans must speak out on the GENOCIDE in Gaza. So must The Contrarian. If you won't acknowledge this for what it is, please make that official and tell us subscribers what stance The Contrarian will take.
The starving children are not Hamas, but should they somehow survive, they might be, in the future, or something even worse than Hamas. Bibi is not concerned about those suffering children now, nor is he worrying about any possible future at all, because he intends to wipe the Palestinians from the face of the earth. Genocide is fine with some people, depending on who the victims are.
I find the Israeli to be lacking in compassion!! This kind of Elimination by Starvation is too reminiscent of Nazi Germany!!!??? What is the point? Gaza has already been destroyed. Let the food aid in and bring your soldiers back to the original border!
One thing we have learned about the long memory of human history is there is always a reckoning. The hand that wielded the sword can become the hand raised seeking mercy.
This is full on genocide, it has been from the start, it is intentional. That Israeli state is committing genocide on the Palestinian people with the help of the USA.
Thank you for speaking the truth. This IS a deliberate attack to eliminate the Palestinian people.
Yes. That's called "genocide."
I will go along with Jennifer on this. There is no question that Israel is committing war crimes. I agree that these war crimes can be considered genocide. The point is that we now have a true humanitarian crisis in Gaza. Quibling over semantics at this juncture is a total waste of time. First, solve the crisis. There will be plenty of time to discuss semantics *after* this mess is resolved.
It is not "quibbling over semantics" to call it genocide.
Genocide has a specific legal meaning and allows for specific legal responses.
Understanding that this is genocide means that punishment for those responsible is an obligation under international law.
This will include not just so many in Israeli leadership and its military, but US leaders as well, since the US has been a bipartisan accomplice to this horror.
We will have to agree to disagree.
I think I understand what you mean here: just take immediate action to alleviate the suffering. The rest is up to the courts.
Quibbling over semantics? Starvation or famine, war crimes or genocide, how we characterize the crisis can determine what steps we take to address it. If we're going to label the crises at all, the labels should be accurate.
Donna, a humanitarian crisis should take priority over semantics. My response is the same as my reply to Jason: " We'll have agree to disagree".
It’s not just a “humanitarian crisis”, although it is certainly that.
Israel is committing genocide, with the bipartisan support of the US.
Say the word, Jennifer Rubin.
Say the word that virtually every human rights organization and genocide scholar has already said.
Genocide.
It’s past time to say it.
Jennifer Rubin and Norm Eisen won't say 'genocide' - here's a small sample of some that do:
Human Rights Organizations:
Amnesty International
Human Rights Watch
University Network for Human Rights
B’Tselem
Physicians for Human Rights - Israel
Genocide Scholars and Experts:
Francesca Albanese, UN special rapporteur on the Occupied Palestinian Territories
Omer Bartov, Israeli-American professor of Holocaust and Genocide Studies at Brown University
Amos Goldberg, Israeli professor in the Department of Jewish History and Contemporary Jewry at the Hebrew University of Jerusalem and a fellow of the Van Leer Jerusalem Institute
Raz Segal, Israeli historian and associate professor of Holocaust and Genocide Studies and endowed professor in the Study of Modern Genocide at Stockton University
Shmuel Lederman, professor specializing in political theory and genocide studies at the Open University of Israel
Martin Shaw, emeritus professor of International Relations and Politics at the University of Sussex, research professor at the Institut Barcelona d'Estudis Internacionals, and author of War and Genocide, What is Genocide, Genocide in International Relations
William Schabas, professor of international law at Middlesex University in the United Kingdom, professor of international human law and human rights at Leiden University in the Netherlands, and author of several books on international law, including Genocide in International Law: The Crimes of Crimes
Dirk Moses, international relations professor at the City College of New York and author of The Problems of Genocide
Daniel Blatman, Israeli historian specializing in the history of the Holocaust and head of the Institute for Contemporary Jewry at the Hebrew University of Jerusalem.
Lee Mordechai, Israeli historian and associate professor at Hebrew University
Melanie O'Brien, president of the International Association of Genocide Scholars
Uğur Ümit Üngör, professor of Genocide Studies at the NIOD Institute for War, Holocaust, and Genocide Studies and the University of Amsterdam
Excellent. Thanks for sending this, Jason. It is just APPALLING that so many Dems and NeverTrumpers have turned a blind eye to the genocide in Gaza. It was awful to see my senator (Schiff) and Klobuchar and Schumer smiling in a photo with Netanyahu last week. They're all complicit in this horror.
Add Marianne Hirsch at Columbia to your list. She is an expert on the Holocaust and was featured in the LA Times yesterday.
Thanks / there are many more as well.
Ugh yea, I have mentioned that here several times, so revolting…. And still never referenced The Contrarian. It’s important to note support for Israel’s genocide has been bipartisan all along.
Absolutely. It was Biden's greatest failing, I think. We still can only get 16 or 17 Dems to vote against continued arms. Let's see if we do better this week, with Bernie's latest amendments.
Yikes, I missed that photo. Klobuchar is my senator, and I am ashamed.
Yes, a group photo of about ten senators with Netanyahu. Schiff standing next to Ted Cruz and smiling. Awful. Definitely was Klobuchar.
State whether or not Hamas bears some responsibility.
Irrelevant. An eye for an eye makes both parties blind. Bullets have no party or cause, they are indiscriminate killers. It is the intent of those who use these deadly weapons, not of the victims of their aim. Starvation is intentional when food is readily available, but made a commodity of control.
Of course hamas bears responsibility for attacking israel and one must wonder what their motive was, to have all their people slaughtered or starved in response? Was it to derail some negotiations with saudi arabia? It was bold and suicidal.
What is the rationale for israel to continue the non-military actions (starving, decimating civilian housing, etc.)? I have had supporters of idf's action consistently claim that it could all be stopped by hamas surrendering and giving up the hostages. That they have to restrict food because hamas steals it---yet also claim that somehow the Palestinians are collectively responsible for not turning in hamas fighters. It is like local law enforcement holding grandma responsible for allowing her grandson to deal drugs from their house and not turning him in.
Why not follow the money? How about going after the leaders who apparently live in Qatar and elsewhere and have billions in bank accounts. What keeps israel and the US from sanctioning these host nations and banks?
The ultimate concern for US taxpayers is how do we want our money to be used? We are paying for all of this. Just like we paid for the 20 year invasion of Afghanistan because terrorists attacked us.
From what I understand, Netanyahu did something (don't know exactly what) that enabled Hamas to do the October 7 attack. Maybe Netanyahu was looking for an excuse for war, so he could avoid being tried and convicted for other crimes. I have seen multiple places over the time this has been going on, to that effect.
Good grief!!!!
We danced with joy then hid among the dead – Nova survivors recall Hamas massacre.
https://www.bbc.com/news/videos/c0qznj3l5ypo
Of course, they do! Of course! No one is questioning that.
Not true.
I stand with you, Jason.
Jason, here is your article you have wanted and still...at least recognize it
"Thank you so much, Jennifer Rubin!
Thank you for finally acknowledging what most of the entire world has been shouting for many months now.
Even though you still won't call it 'genocide', even if every scholar and human rights org everywhere has said so ... even though you still haven't acknowledged that the steadfast bipartisan support from the US has made this possible from the start and both Democrats and Republicans are complicit in these crimes against humanity ... even though you have never acknowledged the apartheid and oppression and violence and terror that Israel has inflicted on the Palestinian people for most of living memory - thank you!
Thank you for finally stating what has been obvious to anyone paying attention for a long time now...you're a superhero!"
How's that?
good very good
"Just yesterday, dozens of rabbis were arrested after protesting in front of Senate Majority Leader John Thune’s office, calling for aid in Gaza."
Do we realize that not one American TV Network reported this protest? It was reported by the Israeli Times, The Jerusalem Post, and many other foreign media. But only MSN seems to have covered it in the US! WHY? This is one of the main issues demonstrating our lack of a free press!
It is an issue that allows Trump and the Republicans to lie to voters. Yet, the Democrats remain silent about this! Is there a committee in the DNC that records this anti democracy and pro-Israel disinformation? Do we have a way established by the Democratic Party to counter such an atrocity, one that could sway the American public away from allowing our country to support the Zionist movement (with the help of our Government) to exterminate the families of Gaza?
We need some from the Democratic Party to organize an opposition to the American TV Networks being taken over by Trump! There needs to be far more concern for this issue that we are seeing!
Democrats aren't in power. The Quad are Dems. Pick on the Trump administration.
I agree, and I wrote a comment above where I provided information about the two Israeli rights groups that have labeled it a genocide. That should make a difference. But, it won't matter to Jeffries and Schumer, who received $1.2 M and $1.7 M in 2024 from the American Israeli PAC. ASPAC spent $100 million in the 2024 election buying the votes of Democratic and Republican congresspeople. https://www.aipacpac.org/
Yes. All part of the issue. Who would have thought that the State of Israel could have been taken over by authoritarians? Who would have thought that the Democrats, in addition to the Republicans, would have supported that coup? And in the end, we too, the world's democracy, are a part of the same Coup. But it is not over yet! Schumer, Trump, and Netanyahu all report to the same people. At some point, whether it be Musk, or someone else with that much power, will be rubbed, and when that happens, things can change fast! Hopefully, for the world, that does not take another 40 years!
I won’t be here in 40 years, and I’m not waiting. I want to get rid of Jeffries and Schumer, and I’m thinking about ways to do that!
LOL! Me too!
There IS a purpose to Israeli policy in Gaza and the West Bank: to make them Palestinian-free. Donald Trump and other supporters and enablers of Israeli policy in the United States, as well as those who remain silent, are complicit in the war crimes.
Those “other supporters” include most Democrats in Congress, with a few notable exceptions.
I call bullshit on that statement.
Are you serious?
Maybe start with the 7 Senate Democrats that took a smiling fun photo with the indicted war criminal Netanyahu just weeks ago...then look at the many in both the House and Senate who get massive donations from AIPAC.
Then look at the years worth of public statements and actions from Jeffries, Schumer, Booker, so many others, too many to list...
And of course, there was the full support given to Israel as it committed open and obvious war crimes by the Biden administration for 15 months... not to mention its military and financial support well before then, even when Israel assassinated an American journalist, Shireen Abu Akleh, even when Israel bombed and invaded Gaza numerous times before 2023, and continued its apartheid in the West Bank.
There is no controversy about it, it's an objective fact that most, nearly all , elected Democrats have supported Israel's terror for a long time.
Where is the link of the picture. Please provide that.
It is absolutely a genocide. I don’t see how Israel comes back from this.
Part of the rightwing/authoritarian personality is the need to exact vengeance for real and perceived injuries. What brings them down is that they cannot perceive when enough vengeance has been inflicted... Netanyahu needs to go. The healing can only begin when the hateful autocrat is removed from office.
As well as his enablers.
Same with tRump.
The US and Israel have repeatedly elected fascist regimes. The hallmark of fascism is perpetrating mass murder without a qualm. Netanyahu and his nazh-gul have no compunction about starving children in their thousands. Indeed, they are obviously gleeful about it. Trump wilfully murdered about 300,000 people during covid and ending USAID will send his kill rate well into the millions. These are not the kind of people who have second thoughts about their atrocities.
Thank you for calling out loud the truth of the horror . It is the worst human to human arrogance by people who know history and yet act as though historic actions give some authority to today’s behavior. Obscene.
It appears that tRump's evangelical base is aligned with the far right in the Israeli government. That would be consistent with a drive to ethnically cleanse all of Gaza and install Israeli settlers. In tRump's rantings there were comments about creating an Eastern Mediterranean resort there.
Yes, the far-right evangelicals are hoping to speed up the "Second Coming©" by precipitating Armageddon....They don't give a sh*t about either the Israelis or the Palestinians (of whatever religion). They just want a big enough conflagration.
yes, and "christians" need all Jews back in the holy land for the rapture to occur... what's his face is the ambassador to isrile....his fat daughter was the press sec 1st term of the orange menace. hate being oldish, can't remember shit !
Important point. israel's actions over the last 80 years keep creating new generations of Palestinian rebels
Very unfortunate that these journalists who are very perceptive and courageous don’t call this what it is: genocide
Famine, disease, starvation and death at your doorstep is not an acceptable situation. Unless this situation is remedied then why should the U.S. continue to support Israel? A strong leader would put their foot down. Trump is not that leader. Hoping this ends soon and peacefully.
Trump will not act unless it benefits him personally. His dealmaking is only when it puts money in his pockets.
"This is the way the world ends
This is the way the world ends
This is the way the world ends
Not with a bang but a whimper."
t.s. eliot, The Hollow Men
No, it shouldn't be a linguistic debate. But from Tom Malinowski's July 29th Evening Roundup: "Americans must speak out on the catastrophe in Gaza."
No! Americans must speak out on the GENOCIDE in Gaza. So must The Contrarian. If you won't acknowledge this for what it is, please make that official and tell us subscribers what stance The Contrarian will take.
The starving children are not Hamas, but should they somehow survive, they might be, in the future, or something even worse than Hamas. Bibi is not concerned about those suffering children now, nor is he worrying about any possible future at all, because he intends to wipe the Palestinians from the face of the earth. Genocide is fine with some people, depending on who the victims are.
I find the Israeli to be lacking in compassion!! This kind of Elimination by Starvation is too reminiscent of Nazi Germany!!!??? What is the point? Gaza has already been destroyed. Let the food aid in and bring your soldiers back to the original border!
One thing we have learned about the long memory of human history is there is always a reckoning. The hand that wielded the sword can become the hand raised seeking mercy.
This is full on genocide, it has been from the start, it is intentional. That Israeli state is committing genocide on the Palestinian people with the help of the USA.