133 Comments
User's avatar
Joe Zahner's avatar

We have many wise negotiators in our country that would have far better success with the Iranians. Unfortunately none of them are members of the official cult. Obama had a deal and Trump trashed it.

Charles's avatar

Trump would never agree to send the "A Team" of negotiators. He needs "negotiators", who will abide for and allow his every e whim. Representives who will put up with and support his hundred lies a day without contradicting him. Trump certainly does not want anyone who knows what they are doing.

Anne-Louise Luccarini's avatar

And support his hundred contradictions a day without lying...?

Hiro's avatar

"The Iranians won the war by surviving, inflicting damage on its neighbors with cheap drones, and capturing the Strait of Hormuz. They are not about to forfeit their victory to feckless, deluded Americans led by a compulsive liar." This is the outcome of the Trump war against Iran without consulting the Congress. Now he cannot find a way out.

Hal's avatar

"We have many wise negotiators in our country that would have far better success with the Iranians."

In your opinion, what would "success" look like?

Joe Zahner's avatar

Barack O’Bamas successful negotiations that kept the Iranians from getting a nuclear bomb. It was too good so Trump had to kill it.

Hal's avatar
4hEdited

"Barack O’Bamas successful negotiations that kept the Iranians from getting a nuclear bomb."

Sure, it was so good that even Jen Rubin criticized it:

"“If this were not Iran and the IAEA discovered this, we would be demanding further inspections and interviews with the key scientists involved in weaponization, which Iran has already refused,” sanctions guru Mark Dubowitz tells Right Turn. “Since this is Iran, we won’t be asking because we won’t get any further inspections and the administration lives in fear of doing anything that could collapse the deal. So they invent fictions like we know everything anyway, which is patently untrue, and they preemptively surrender.” He urges Congress insist on physical inspections of Iranian military sites."

"It should be clear to both Democrats and Republicans that the Iran deal allowed Iran to escape scrutiny of past violations and left plenty of room to maneuver and evade future inspections. It should likewise be clear that fear of losing the deal has led the administration to countenance Iran’s non-nuclear misbehavior. With a new president should come a new Iran policy, one that halts new concessions (e.g. dollar transactions), applies new economic pressure and, where possible, claws back concessions the prior administration made. If nothing else, a tougher stance against Iran will persuade our Sunni allies that we have stopped deluding ourselves about the nature of the Iranian regime."

https://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/right-turn/wp/2016/06/20/new-evidence-of-irans-chicanery-and-the-obama-administrations/

And this from The Free Press:

"Debunking Seven Myths About the Iran War" by Michael Doran

"While arguing about the war, former Obama and Biden staffers are attempting to justify Obama’s nuclear deal and the strategy that produced it. The JCPOA, Sullivan tells Stewart, worked. Iran was “complying with the deal. Even the Israeli intelligence were saying they were complying with the agreement.” Trump’s 2018 unilateral withdrawal, Sullivan suggests, discarded this successful state of affairs.

This story fails to comport with reality in three crucial ways. First, the timeline doesn’t work. Trump withdrew from the nuclear deal in May 2018. Tehran did not begin enriching its uranium to 60 percent, a major threshold that dramatically shortens the path to a nuclear weapon, until April 2021. In other words, Tehran made this crucial leap toward weaponization on Biden’s watch, not Trump’s."

Joe Zahner's avatar

Hal you don’t seem to be a very popular correspondent based on your profile. Are you a real person?

Hal's avatar
3hEdited

"Hal you don’t seem to be a very popular correspondent based on your profile."

Yeah, how dare I refuse to accept Jen's premise or narrative, which is almost always "anti-Trump". Sometimes I think she'd rather have an anuerysm than agree with anything he says or does. I have criticized Trump and his policies on multiple occasions in this forum. How many here have ever critically questioned Jen Rubin about anything?

"Are you a real person?"

I have been accused of being a bot multiple times in the past...but yes I am real.

Joe Zahner's avatar

Good to know. I figured you had a more detailed and thought out response than the average Bot.

Peter Ambrose MD's avatar

Historically, having read Jennifer for years, she started on the RIGHT but then. saw the LIGTH.

Mike Yochim's avatar

It’s a sad state of affairs when the American people believe a foreign government over its own.

Mark D Olson's avatar

Right? I have more respect for China and North Korea than I do this regime. How can John thune and mike johnson sit doing nothing? How can republicans sit doing nothing? the Epstein files should have been enough to rid the US of this trash.

Nancy's avatar
7hEdited

So what do we conclude? We elect stupid people? We elect power-hungry grifters? We elect weak-minded followers? None of that speaks well of the American people. The one negative I hear consistently from friends who live and travel abroad: How can Americans have elected these people? Maybe all of the above questions can be answered with a resounding "yes." That's who we've elected, on purpose. And Iran looks better than we do, as captured in the last sentence of the post: They are not about to forfeit their victory to feckless, deluded Americans led by a compulsive liar.

John K. Alexnder's avatar

We must never forget that Trump was NOT elected by a majority of the American people. This MINORITY President comes via the Electoral College.

Anne-Louise Luccarini's avatar

Thanks. People seem to have slid over that again. The Electoral College is like a lead weight round a swimmer's neck.

Steve 218's avatar

That was the first administration. In 2024, a bleak 1.5% of the people who decided to vote, voted for Trump. Hardly a mandate, but sadly, a majority who bothered to show up. Do we need to make voting mandatory, as it is in Australia?

KnockKnockGreenpeace's avatar

Every time someone asks that question, I think, Do we really want magas to be compelled to vote? So, you have your answer to that rhetorical question.

Steve 218's avatar

MAGAs don't seem to have a problem getting out to vote. The hate/racist element is always present. it's more the independents and non-committal individuals who need encouragement.

patricia's avatar

in the past americans did not feel the need to vote because things were going well , and that was sort of true...we need mandatory voting because "we" still don't get it and it will be too late when all realiiize ...oh yeah maybe I should have voted...

patricia's avatar

this time he did win the popular vote, and yes, the electoral college is the real voter fraud... right from it's inception

patricia's avatar

americans have long been thought of as idiots...we have certainly proved those thoughts to be true...

patricia's avatar

I am still taken aback at how dumb amers are though...

Steve 218's avatar

Considering that Republican leadership has been intent upon sacking public education for decades, evidence is that they hve had success.

Richard Brody's avatar

Apparently in our elections money, big money talks. Think about the hundreds of millions of dollars contributed to the T…p coffers by billionaire “bros” who sought monetary and other rewards from electing a “feckless” bully. It’s also due to the ignorance and lackadaisical approach to participating in elections. How many times have we heard “If I had only known”? Well, folks we tried to tell you but the billionaires who own and control the media and channels of information blocked the truth from coming out. Here’s the truth: We need to get rid of this monster and anyone who’s supported him or works for him in order to create a path towards normalcy. Money may talk, yes, but bullshit needs to take a long walk off a short pier.

Lydia Lucas's avatar

I think the real issue -- more than any media moguls blocking channels of information -- comes down to the old adage "none there is so blind as he who will not see." Trump (and his minions) showed us who he is, told us who he is, acted out who he is -- in his first term, all during the Biden administration, and in his 2024 campaign. Probably many people just didn't think he would speak and act as he has because no President in history has spoken and acted like that before. But still . . . we were amply warned.

Steve 218's avatar

The big money influence was aided and abetted by the Citizens United decision. The supreme court has backed us out of other legacy decisions; they should revisit this one for the error that it was.

Mike Bechler's avatar

"How can Americans have elected these people?"

11th grade sociology class, day one: "People facing diminished expectations will make irrational decisions."

Hal's avatar
5hEdited

"We elect stupid people? We elect power-hungry grifters? We elect weak-minded followers?"

Yes, and it applies to both parties.

"None of that speaks well of the American people."

Totally agree.

"The one negative I hear consistently from friends who live and travel abroad: How can Americans have elected these people?"

We can say the same thing about leaders other countries select. The thing is, views outside one's own country are irrelevant to your own elections.

"And Iran looks better than we do, as captured in the last sentence of the post: They are not about to forfeit their victory to feckless, deluded Americans led by a compulsive liar."

Jen Rubin, along with most of the media and the Democratic Party are 100% invested in Trump's defeat because, well...Trump is bad? They are willing to accept a nuclear-armed Iran in exchange for that...are you? For what it's worth, I don't accept Jen's premise that Iran has "won" anything yet.

Mike Bechler's avatar

I'm with you on that. I wouldn't mind if Trump had a heart attack and croaked, but as long as he is in charge, I wish him well in Iran so we can close this chapter and get back to Epstein.

Anne-Louise Luccarini's avatar

M Johnson with his pussycat smile.

Steve 218's avatar

When "its own" (TACO) lies at 90 miles per hour and ignores the reality of what's actually happening, why should anyone be surprised?

Anne-Louise Luccarini's avatar

While this is the "government" in question, I'm relieved that the American people choose to believe a foreign government instead.

Daniel Solomon's avatar

The comment "I have more respect for China and North Korea than I do this regime." is proof that Russian psy ops works.

All sides in this "negotiation" have "unclean hands." The WATNA for both is nuclear annihilation.

Want to get rid of our tyrant, EPSTEIN is still the magic word.

Alexandra's avatar

Especially the Iranian government!

Debbie Davis's avatar

I saw MSNOW reports that Kushner's and Witkoff's lack of knowledge of any nuclear is a great hindrance to their ability to negotiate with Iran. In fact, at least one expert said that an agreement that was moving forward just before Trump began bombing them would have been a good agreement, but that Kushner and Witkoff did not understand or recognize that. There reportedly have been no U.S. nuclear experts involved in the negotiations. All I can do is shake my head many times each day at the things that are happening.

Tracy S's avatar

If either one of them actually cared about this country instead of enriching themselves, they wouldn't be "negotiators".

Elvi's avatar

Maybe Jared forgot to order some books from Amazon on nuclear science. He coulda been a negotiator.

Steve 218's avatar

It isn't just that the pair have no nuclear experience, they have no experience period. Trump has set rank amateurs up against smart officials with an agenda of self preservation.

CE's avatar

We have real estate fellas, unpaid , working only for Donald J Trump and not for the American people, digging for personal gold in the Middle East. We have a completely untrustworthy “president”, a weak and sycophantic Congress…..what could possibly go right?

Hank Friedman's avatar

This negotiating "dynamic duo" {Insert sarcasm font.} is being paid. Just not by the USG. They will make plenty of deals with other ME countries.

Steve 218's avatar

True that. Jared is out beating the bushes in the region's countries for funding Affinity Partners - his own private company. What price for peace? Jared, you're an opportunistic crook.

Richard Brody's avatar

It’s no longer the “art of the deal”. It’s the fart, the smelly truth that emanates from our side of the negotiating table.

Rich Stockton's avatar

As I have said in the past, Trumps Iran problem is twofold. First, he thinks the Iranians are stupid, they're not. Second, the Iranians know that he is.

Anne-Louise Luccarini's avatar

So does everybody except for an increasing number of Americans. It's taking too long.

Steve 218's avatar

By the evidence, it's a decreasing number of Americans. A majority is fully against this illegal war of choice.

Ann's avatar

The buffoons are hard at work in this administration. Iran has all the aces…Trumpie and crew have the joker cards. What a clusterfuck

Signe K.'s avatar

I hate to admit it, but Iran's lego videos trolling Trump are excellent, and aimed at a younger audience (great music, rap style). Very entertaining, and underscores both the incompetence and --as you said-- buffoonery of the US "leadership."

Bob Egbert's avatar

Force or the threat of force. That is absolutely the only thing that will change the behavior of the WH Crime Boss. His Criminal Cabinet Thugs will never use the 25th amendment. That leaves the MAGA Fascist Senators. Like the WH Crime Boss, they will only respond to the force or threat of force at the polls. That threat must come from a bone-chilling fear of being crushed in the next election. They must Impeach & Convict. Not likely to happen, but the remaining American voters who still have possession of basic human decency must do every legal thing they can to cut out and crush the MAGA Cancer in Congress. If not, the destruction of the USA will continue until at least January of 2029.

Pam Birkenfeld's avatar

It would be great if we could do it but when you look at this report you’ll wonder whether we can overcome this. https://deanblundell.substack.com/p/peter-thiels-palantir-the-company?r=dvmn6&utm_medium=ios

David Shuford's avatar

I am getting definite Trump Covid vibes here. Trump is bored and irritated with his powerlessness so he resorts to gloss to prop up his ego and motivate his supporters. It has only taken a month for Iran to call “bullsh*t” on Trump’s approach (which is 10 years longer than it has taken us here in the U.S.) The Iranian regime is a horrible, evil and fundamentalist crew, fomenting terror in the Middle East, but it is not inherently stupid. Our regime seems intent on replicating those characteristics but adding fundamental stupidity to the equation and a much wider intention of terrorizing not just a region, but the entire planet.

Nancy's avatar

Well said! You've captured the moment well.

Irena's avatar

It would be fair if you would also point out that Iran never speaks wholehearted truth. It is a master of obfuscation. It would also be very valuable if you would keep pointing out "Iran’s missile program or support for regional terrorist groups" as extremely important aspects of why this regime is a terror, literally and figuratively, for the Middle East and for everywhere in the world it "exports" its primary "asset": TERROR.

Nancy's avatar

You're right, and right now, they look smarter than we do. How sad....

Irena's avatar

The Persian-Iranian culture has been around for many centuries and has perfected the art of dissembling. That "art" is quite evident in Middle East and Asian cultures. The United States is, literally, the new kid on the international block.

Anne-Louise Luccarini's avatar

They have a rival nation.

John Ryan(PA)'s avatar

The GOP, all of it, should be flabbergasted that the president keeps sending morons to negotiate. Instead they keep sticking their heads in the sand. They are spineless, and those who voted for ANY of them are clueless.

Anne Pierce's avatar

Trump hates expertise of any sort. This was apparent during his first term, and has become even more obvious in his second term. He trusts the people he sent to be totally loyal to him, and never mind that they don't understand what is being negotiated (and didn't bring experts with them).

Signe K.'s avatar

Right. He "knows more than the generals do." (insert barfing sound here)

Douglas Mackay's avatar

Painted into a corner. Up a creek without a paddle. No cards. American hubris keeps this game of death alive. The weakness of the US position seems obvious, given what little information is shared about this calamity. Maybe if Trump hadn’t boxed out the press from being embedded with troops, from consistent military briefings, and constant derision of the press’ purpose we would be better informed about this “excursion.” Which brings up the point about truthful information, solid facts, and clearly stated objectives would have gone a long way to helping us understand this debacle. Mixed and incorrect information does not help and leads to more confusion, mockery, and anger.

Steve 218's avatar

Hegseth and his mistreatment of the media and firing of experienced military leadership at the Pentagon reflect on this as well.

Lydia Lucas's avatar

And it was deliberate.

Jeffrey Waingrow's avatar

Jen, this is a beautifully written summary of the state of things. I'm most grateful for your tireless efforts.

Ivan Tufaart's avatar

In Trumpland, just saying something makes it so, facts notwithstanding-- especially if Don the Con says it.

Marc Donner's avatar

What is astonishing to me is the Trump regime's complete inability to understand that the Iranian government has agency. They are not computer-game NPCs programmed to do whatever Trump wants, they are people. And, as Trump would say, Trump has no cards. Bombs, yes. Cards, no.

Don Kennedy's avatar

Such is the nature of massive narcissism in Trump (I am the world, and the world is me) and massive sycophany in all of his cabinet.

Anne Pierce's avatar

Iran has done what it said it would do - it opened Hormuz when Israel agreed to a cease-fire in Lebanon. Trump, for unknown reasons, instead of dropping the US blockade at that point, kept it in place and forcibly took over an Iranian-flagged cargo ship. Why in the world would Iran do anything Trump wants at this point? He is completely untrustworthy and confuses negotiation with capitulation. At this point, the best we can hope for is Hormuz opened with tolls, and a more substantial cease-fire. So the world will be worse off than before Trump started his war of choice.

Patricia Dempsey's avatar

I have never understood why Trump kept the blockade in place when Iran opened the Strait. What would be the purpose of that? I feel as though I'm stupid that I don't get it but honestly.... it seems at cross purposes with Iran's opening the Strait. Can anybody make me understand this?

James's avatar

We are so being played. Why can't we send grownups to negotiate for us?

Obviously, Iran hasn't gotten the memo that if you repeat a lie often enough, it becomes true.

Don Kennedy's avatar

Because a massive narcissist runs the executive branch, and not us nor anyone else of normal emotional health.