On a special addition of The Tea, April is joined by federal worker and organizer for the Federal Unionist Network (FUN), Paul Osadebe. As day 9 of the government shutdown begins with seemingly no resolution in sight, it’s critical to stay informed of all the kinds of harm the shutdown causes. Federal workers are furloughed, key services are paused, and the economy is suffering all because Republicans refused to give Americans the healthcare they deserve.
Osadebe discusses how he was personally impacted by the Trump administration, his work at FUN, and how the power of the people are stronger than the people in power.
Paul Osadebe is a federal worker, a union steward with AFGE Local 476, and an organizer with the Federal Unionists Network.
The transcript below has been edited slightly for clarity.
April Ryan
Welcome to the tea again with April. We’re in a government shutdown. People are hurting. It’s not just the federal quadrant in Washington, D.C. The tentacles extend beyond Washington into this nation. I’ve said it before, and I’m gonna say it again. It’s not just Democrats, it’s not just black and brown people, it’s everyone. Red states.
Alone, over 900,000, almost a million people in red states alone will be impacted. Federal government workers. That’s just red states. So this is not a Democratic or Republican thing, this is an everybody thing. And it’s unfortunate from the White House, you cannot necessarily always trust what is said. You have to go fact check, and use critical thinking, and with us today, I’m just very pleased to have Paul Osadebe with us. He is a member of the steering committee, for the Federal Unionist Network, and Paul Osadebe is a federal worker who says that he is on the list for removal. He’s one of those federal workers who are impacted. It’s not just…the, air traffic controllers, everybody’s focused on the air traffic controllers and TSA. Every time I go through TSA, I’m flying every week, and I tell them, thank you for working, because that is a national security issue. All of this is a national security issue. Paul, thank you so much for joining us. In this moment, what do we need to know? Because I understand that if this thing is not fixed in a week and a half. It could go much longer than anticipated.
Paul Osadebe
Absolutely. We’ve been in a shutdown for a couple days now, and people are facing the risk of not being able to pay their bills, not getting their paychecks, and not being able to work and provide the services that we came here to provide. But it’s really important to know that we’ve been in the middle of a shutdown for 9 months now. Huge parts of the government have not been able to do their jobs, including my part of the government. I work at the Department of Housing. I’m a civil rights lawyer. I try to make sure that you have access to equal housing wherever you are, no matter who you are. That’s what I wake up every day to do, and we have been under so many restrictions. Since day one, so many people have been fired, or forced to resign, or prevented from doing basic work for you, the American people, and that’s what they want. They’re trying to use this shutdown to lock that in, and to make it so that the government after this is what it is during a shutdown. Fewer people, fewer services, and less help for you.
April Ryan
People and services are being cut, ripped apart. Now, let’s go to you specifically. So, basically, the Fair Housing Act of 1968 is not even in existence anymore, in this administration. You are a civil rights lawyer in the housing department. That’s crazy, but see, this is what I learned from the first administration from the first Trump administration. they shut down the Civil Rights Division at the Justice Department. So, were you surprised when they are… that they’re trying to remove you from housing?
Paul Osadebe
No, I mean, I expected some pretty significant changes, But people had worked in the first administration, and there were a lot of things that they disagreed with, and that were improper, and that could have been challenged. But that is a completely different situation from what we’re dealing with now. It’s gone from, gag orders telling us we can’t talk to other parts of the government, and parts of HUD itself to make sure that HUD is following the law, all the way to just getting rid of investigations, getting rid of charges that we’re legally required to bring. Like, we are the part of the federal government that when someone comes to us with a complaint, we’re legally required to investigate that, and then charge that if we find that discrimination probably happened. Every part of what I just said is being dismantled. The investigation, charging, settling. All of it. And this is different than anything that’s happened before. This isn’t just, like, a policy disagreement. This isn’t about priorities. We’re not being allowed to enforce the law. So people are being left unprotected.
April Ryan
So, you were on the list for removal. Were you… were you getting paid when you were put on the list, or are you no longer being paid?
Paul Osadebe
I’m currently still being paid, but, due to the shutdown, I’m not being paid. So it’s, the same things that are happening to me already are now happening to… to everyone through the shutdown.
April Ryan
So there are various lawsuits from unions against the federal government in this shutdown. In reality, what do you think will happen?
Paul Osadebe, AFGE 476
I think the lawsuits can buy us time, and I think that they’ll win on a lot of the things, because a lot of these actions are blatantly illegal. There’s no justification for them at all. It’s just an attempt to silence and scare and threaten people into not having their rights. But ultimately, the win from unions is not going to come from the courts, because the courts are kind of cooked. We all know that. It’s gonna come from people power. It’s gonna come from lobbying. It’s gonna come from organizing in the workplace, which is what fun is about, and what unions are about, and it’s gonna come from all of us, using our influence and our voices.
Whatever we can to connect with people that care about having housing, or healthcare, or veteran services, whatever it is that you care about, there’s so many more of us that care about that than tax cuts for billionaires or, allowing the president to have yet another power. If we all join together, I think we could see a lot more change than what we’re seeing right now.
April Ryan
You said that it’s gonna buy you some time. What do you mean? Is it buying time if the government is open again, and it buys you time from not having another shutdown, or creating a CR? Because a CR is basically over healthcare, and how do you buy time if they’re fighting over another issue and you guys are in the middle?
Paul Osadebe, AFGE 476
What I mean is that in the past, when they’ve, sued over things and won initially and then lost, that was several months of services for people. That was months of paychecks, that was time where you still have an officially recognized union to organize with. And that means a lot. I mean, they were initially planning to cut 83,000 jobs at the VA, and they had a union to organize with, and they were trying to get rid of it, but the union sued, and they won for a little bit. And during that period is when the unions organized with veterans groups and, just people that care about healthcare, and they were able to stop those cuts. That’s what I mean by buying time, and in that time, we can do a lot to save things.
April Ryan
People are afraid. I have never seen the fear that I see with people right now, and you saw people out walking in the streets and protesting. But people are scared to… now, they’re not afraid to be whistleblowers, but they’re afraid to speak up in the office. Are you encountering a lot of that? Because I know you’re looking for people power, but I’m seeing people are more afraid to speak up in this moment.
Paul Osadebe
Yes, there’s definitely a lot of fear, and that’s something that’s been created, of course, through firings, through retaliation, through new policies, everything that they could do to kind of put a check on people’s willingness to speak out, they’ve done.
But in this moment, in addition to all the fear, we’re also seeing a new level of solidarity among coworkers. Like, I’m in group chats with so many of my coworkers. We’re gonna go to a potluck together later today. We’ve been brought together more by all this, as well, and we’ve seen that collective action is a lot stronger than anything that you do individually, and there’s a lower chance of retaliation when, in order to retaliate, they would have to fire your entire office, or they would have to, really risk a backlash from the public. That’s what we need to be doing. Moving together will protect all of us, and will raise the chance of whatever we do working in the first place.
April Ryan
Republicans have always wanted smaller government to what cost? I mean, some of these furloughs will be permanent. You’re not coming back. What is the cost? Because we already know that national security is at risk at the airports. People aren’t being able to travel like they… we’re seeing airports shutting down because air traffic controllers are not able to pay their mortgage. TSA people, how do you show up for work when you don’t have gas to get to the job, and money to have your uniform laundered, and money for lunch?
Paul Osadebe
Just to eat. Yeah, just to eat. Yeah, it’s… A lot of people seem to think that the government, what it does is not necessary, or that it only does things that they don’t like, but it does so many things that are central to day-to-day life. Making sure that the air and water is clean and breathable, making sure that healthcare is funded. Your hospital, whether you use Medicaid or Medicare or not, that hospital would not be there if it was not funded by Medicaid. Veterans’ healthcare, I mean, housing, the… the nice new housing that you’re… you’re dreaming, you’re saving up for, it’s not going to be there if a bank decides we don’t want to put it there, because there’s too many Black people there, or there’s too many, just people of color, too many families with kids live there. That’s what I’m supposed to be regulating and making sure that that housing is built where you live. But without the government there, that’s not gonna happen.
April Ryan
So this is the new redlining. This is the new redlining. If I don’t want… keeping those you want in in, and those you don’t want out. It’s not just about race anymore. And let me tell you, I understand about redlining, and guys, if you don’t know, look it up. It started here in Baltimore. I’m from Baltimore. Paul, and I…I made a deliberate decision to move in a neighborhood that they told us we couldn’t move into in the 50s and 60s, because they told us not to. And now we’re going back to that.
The importance of you and your job, the job in general, the freedoms and the rights are being…removed, as well as the job. SNAP, WIC, Services, payments to people. We are in a crisis. This is crisis moment, guys. Yeah. And it’s not a… it’s crisis. I don’t know if anybody called it out, but I’m calling it out.
And the bottom line is, it impacts you. And not only just… okay, let’s say you’re not a federal worker. But you get federal services, or services that get federal funding. Look, Paul, even in entertainment industry, they get grants. I was told from an A-lister who I don’t… I cannot say her name, and you guys know who she is, because you guys love her to death. She’s won awards, Grammys, well, not a Grammy, an Oscar. She may have won a Grammy. She’s won an Oscar… she’s won a whole bunch of Golden Globes, and she said in the entertainment industry are not getting grants. Those are some things that happen. But think about this also. It’s not just federal workers. For those businesses that sit around these federal office buildings that rely on dry cleaning, support. They rely on food, you know, lunches, breakfast, etc, and all those other support agencies. They’re gonna be impacted. The economy is going to tank. This is a turn that we’re watching. This is a crisis. Paul, if you had a chance to talk to the President of the United States, what would you say to him right now?
Paul Osadebe
I would say we just want to serve the American people. We took an oath to serve the people, defend the Constitution, and protect people, and all we’re asking is to be allowed to do that to the fullest. So, I’d ask him to get out of our way, let us do our jobs.
And, ultimately, that oath is an oath to defend the Constitution and the American people against all enemies, foreign and domestic, and someone who takes away their services, takes away their free speech, takes away their right to organize.
That is someone that we have to defend the public against, and we will do that. So…
April Ryan
Yeah.
Paul Osadebe
That’s what we’re gonna organize to do. That’s what the oath means in this moment. Normally we would have just done our jobs. You’re not letting us do that, so in this moment, we have to organize.
April Ryan
You’re very polite in what you would say, but I’ve seen signs out in the street.
Paul Osadebe
Yeah?
April Ryan
Yeah, that, that have, some very provocative words, some pejoratives as well, you know.
Paul Osadebe
I have to keep it respectful, even if… even if he doesn’t always, I will.
April Ryan
This isn’t a respectful moment, this is life or death. You know, I watched something yesterday. A woman who worked for the FDA, who regulate… who gives the announcements about regulation for pacemakers. There’s no more information coming from the federal government if your pacemaker is defective, or if there’s a recall. People don’t understand how the depths of where this is going. I know people, someone I work with, I know I have family members who have pacemakers.
Recalls on food. Guys, this is impacting you. You better look at your meat. You better watch your produce. This impacts you in so many ways. Paul, is there anything else you’d like to add? Because I’m getting kind of upset.
Paul Osadebe
Since the election, I’ve heard a lot of people saying that, well, I didn’t vote for this, and this is not, I don’t want to get involved in fighting back against this, because we’ve been fighting for a long time, people aren’t listening to us, and I get that. It’s very frustrating to… to see all this being done when you didn’t support it, but what they want is for you to drop out, to not be involved in things. They’re counting on that. If everyone who felt that things are going in the wrong way were to just take one or two steps to defend what they care about, join with other people to defend what they care about, we’d be in a much better place. This is not the time to say, it’s above me, this is not my problem. It’s the problem. Y’all handle it. No, no, no, no, no. That is what they want from you.
April Ryan
Every aspect of life is touched. And the last government shutdown, the longest government shutdown that Donald Trump had, it was the longest in history, 30-some days, and it was during Christmas time. And people who were furloughed or told they didn’t have to go to work, they got their money back. Now, this time, they’re talking about they don’t know if they’re gonna get their money.
Paul Osadebe
Yeah.
April Ryan
There are gonna be bankruptcies, there’s gonna be communities impacted. I’m not just talking about households, I’m talking about communities with foreclosed homes. The economy’s gonna tank. You’re gonna see a lot more people going to church, going to food pantries. This is a crisis. And just think about this. This is…
The president is saying this is the Democrats’ fault, but who’s in charge? Then, on top of this, Paul, and I’mma let you go. The last government shutdown was over something petty, over a temper tantrum over the border wall. You didn’t say it, I’m saying it, because I’m still there. I was there. Over a border wall, during Christmas time! It’s Marie Antoinette “Let Them Eat Cake.”
Because there’s not an understanding of the plight of people when you sit in a lofty perch, and you can go travel to another place, and let your family get billions of dollars of business while people just trying to figure out how I’m gonna pay my cable bill, how I’m gonna keep my lights on, how I’m gonna keep my phone on, how I’m gonna put my kids through school, how I’m gonna eat. I’m sorry.
Paul Osadebe
Yeah, it’s worth getting angry about.
April Ryan
My mother was a government employee. A lot of my family are government employees. I get it. But I also get the ripple effect. The economy is going to be impacted, guys, and it’s going to impact you.
Paul Osadebe, Steering Committee Member for FUN, the Federal Unionist Network. Thank you. Thank you. I don’t think we are outraged enough. And I wanna… I’m inviting you back to come back and give us the lay of the land, detail it, and I wish you well. You’re a lawyer, and I know you can’t say so much about your situation.
But please go out there and fight. Continue to fight. And I thank you for what you do, and thank you for joining us for the tea. Come sip some tea with us some more, okay?
Paul Osadebe
Love to.
April Ryan
Thank you, Paul.
Paul Osadebe
Thank you.
