SNAP benefits expire this week, and yet the Trump Administration is declining to tap into emergency funds to feed millions of Americans. Representative Chellie Pingree (D-ME) joins Jen from Washington, D.C. where, unlike most Republicans, she is working for her constituents.
“It’s a disaster, it’s so cruel,” Rep. Pingree shares, unpacking the Republican strategy behind refusing to pass a stand-alone, clean bill to feed Americans and pay federal employees. According to the representative, the Republicans’ concerted effort to hit blue states actually hurts their own constituents in red states, including veterans, seniors, and children.
Watch the entire interview to learn more about what is at stake, why Republicans are not coming to work, and the weaponization of the USDA.
Representative Chellie Pingree (D) represents Maine’s 1st district. She is a ranking member of the Appropriation Committee’s Subcommittee on Interior, Environment, and Related Agencies. Pingree has represented her district since 2008 and was the first woman elected for her district.
Transcript has been edited slightly for clarity.
Jen Rubin: Hi, this is Jen Rubin, Editor-in-Chief of the Contrarian. We are delighted to welcome back Congresswoman Pingree from the great state of Maine. Welcome, Congresswoman.
Chellie Pingree: Thank you so much for having me.
Jen Rubin: So, come November 1, the administration plans on stopping payment for food stamps, otherwise known as SNAP. This has never been done during a government shutdown. Why are they stopping the payment for food for seniors, disabled people, children, other folks?
Chellie Pingree: Well, it’s about as mean and cruel as anything you could possibly imagine. Why are they doing it? Because they can, I guess, unless they lose the lawsuit, that’s about to come up. But the fact is, you’ve heard the president say over and over again, you know, I’m gonna stop those Democrat programs, I’m gonna hurt the blue states. And under no stretch of the imagination are SNAP benefits specific to the Democratic states or to blue states. This will hit people hard in the South, in rural areas. This hits veterans, this hits seniors, this hits children, about 1 in 8 Americans. So, the impact will be broad. My colleagues on the other side of the aisle will hear from their constituents just as much as we do. And it’s this convoluted notion that the president and his accolades have that somehow, just because Democrats typically defend the SNAP benefit program, somehow it only helps people that we care about.
Jen Rubin: And the money, although we, of course, do not have a, budget right now because the Republicans haven’t done their homework, there is money in reserve, and there is the ability to move money around. So this seems to be a deliberate choice to use food, rather than to come up with a sensible solution like every single president has done before this.
Chellie Pingree: Yeah, it’s shocking, really, because this one specifically has a contingency fund at the USDA. Some accounts $5 billion, some $6, but somewhere around $5 to $6 billion, and it costs $8 to $9 billion a month. So they have the majority of the money. We’ve also seen them move money around recklessly, however they damn well please. So the idea that they’re constrained, Speaker Johnson was trying to say, oh, we couldn’t possibly do that. I mean, I’m sorry, that’s just utter bullshit. They move around money, like reckless thieves. They don’t care about the Constitution, the law, they don’t care about the appropriations process, so they could easily do that. In fact, by all accounts, their website originally said they could do this, and this would not be a problem. So they’ve deliberately chosen to do this. They started, announcing it early to put the fear of God into people, and hopefully, I guess, you know, get states all nerved up about it, or to just, you know, unfortunately, make a lot of people feel very scared about what they’re gonna do, because this is the last week, on the last benefit check, so people are thinking about, oh my god, I’m almost out of money, what am I gonna do?
Jen Rubin: What does this look like in Maine? What are the numbers that you’re seeing, and what do you expect to happen, come November 1 if this isn’t solved?
Chellie Pingree: So, we have about 170,000 people on SNAP benefits, and, you know, that may not sound like a lot in a big state, but we’re only 1.3 million people, so a considerable amount of the state, about 35,000 kids, 6,000 veterans, a lot of senior citizens depend on SNAP benefits. And one of the things that people, I think, often misunderstand is that there is nowhere near enough capacity in our food banks, and we have a great, robust food bank network, but there’s about, nine times as much money that goes out every month, through SNAP benefits as through a food bank. So that would mean we’d have to increase our capacity at food banks about tenfold. They’re already seeing long lines because you’ve got people out of work, you’ve got the high cost of food, as well as, you know, utilities, housing, everything else that has gone up. So food banks were already feeling stress. We just had a, you know, a ribbon cutting at a food bank a couple of days ago, and so I had a chance to talk to a lot of people who work in this field, and they’re panic-stricken about what they’re going to do. So this will have a huge impact in our state, and the majority of people who receive SNAP benefits are already working one or two jobs. So, this mis, you know, characterized notion that these are lazy people, you know, just get off your butt and go to work, is just not true. You can’t make ends meet right now, and people are really gonna struggle.
Jen Rubin: from the information that I have seen, Republicans will say, well, the states can do it, or the cities can do it. Are there billions of dollars lying around in state coffers, or in local city or county coffers to pick up the slack here? I’m not aware of it.
Chellie Pingree: Well, just think about it. We’ve been through 9 or 10 months of this administration cutting deeply into a whole variety of things, whether it’s education, you know, the EPA, housing… I mean, states are already being impacted by huge cuts, so there’s not a lot of spare cash kicking around anyway, and they’re facing even bigger cuts with the big ugly bill and some of the future Medicaid cuts. So states aren’t thinking, like, oh, we’re flush with cash. Second, there are some prohibitions already coming from the USDA that says if you try to make up the money, you will not be reimbursed. That’s probably one of the things that’ll be challenged in the courts. The third thing is, most states that are trying to do something are putting money into the food banks, and as I said, that’s a really important effort that will need to be done, but you can’t begin to put enough money. I think in Maine, we’d need about $30 million this month our SNAP need. You just can’t do it. You can’t do it through a food bank. We don’t have the money laying around. Most states don’t have that level of flexibility, and the federal government has told them not to. One other slight complication is that states send the information to the federal government about who is eligible for the coming month. And that gets filled into an EBT card that is, you know, given directly to the person who’s going to use the aid. Well, the fact is, states were told quite a while ago not to do that, so they’re already behind. The federal government doesn’t have the money, and the states don’t have an easy way to just go about doing that. The eligibility, all this other information. So, anyway, it’s…It’s a disaster. It’s so cruel, and, states, you know, are going to want to kick in, but it’s not going to be easy to fix this problem.
Jen Rubin: And you make a great point, Congresswoman. Even if suddenly the administration were to capitulate, because the information has not been inputted, there will be some kind of disruption in service, and people will be delayed. It’s not as if they can just go hungry for a couple weeks until the paperwork comes through. This is a tragedy any which way you look.
Chellie Pingree: Yeah, and don’t forget, I mean, the USDA has already been stripped of a lot of staff, so who knows how many of the eligibility people are either furloughed, or not available, or already lost their jobs completely. So, and, you know, this is one of those most unusual times, in fact, unprecedented. As a member of the Appropriations Committee. I sit on Agapropes, we would normally know all these things. We would know, you know, where have staff been cut, you know, what’s the anticipated time if this was to change, you know, all that stuff. Well, they just operate in the dark, in secret, they don’t tell us anything. I don’t think the Republicans know either, so it’s not as if, you know, there’s somebody who actually knows what’s going on. It’s a mystery, and it’s a disaster.
Jen Rubin: I read there are even a handful of Republican senators, like Senator Collins, Senator Capito, who want to take a stand-alone vote. In other words, okay, keep the government closed, but let’s just feed people. The Republicans aren’t, allowing that. And as far as I know, as of today, the Congress, the Republicans aren’t even there to take a vote, should there be a vote. They’re still on vacation, is that right?
Chellie Pingree: Absolutely, yes, you’re right. Senator Collins and others have said, you know, we want to have a standalone vote, there have been some letters written, so there’s definitely… I mean, Republicans know this is not good. They know it’s cruel, they know it’s not good in their home districts. But as you said, even if the Senate was to take a standalone vote, and I’ve heard that Senator Thune has said today, no, no standalone votes, we’re just going to wait for this shutdown to end, you have the House that is steadfastly against coming in. And if there were to be a standalone vote in the Senate, we would have to have a comparable vote in the House. Now, everybody knows, if you just go quickly back into your memory bank, that Johnson’s not going to bring people in, because that would, require him to swear in Representative Gohalva, that would mean it would trigger the discharge petition, that would mean we would have to move forward on the Jeffrey Epstein files. I also think that the reason the Republicans aren’t coming in right now, which again is unprecedented, I’ve never been through a shutdown that you don’t spend all your time in Washington, if nothing else, just hoping somebody will cut a deal, like waiting to do your job, or having other committee work, or taking other votes. But Johnson’s not doing that, and I think one of the other reasons is he doesn’t want all his members in the halls, he doesn’t want them talking to the press. I mean, because who’s gonna have a microphone shoved in their face and say. yeah, let them eat cake. You know, I mean, who’s gonna do that? Or who’s gonna talk about, now that it’s, you know, almost November, what their constituents are hearing about their healthcare plan? So, I think Johnson doesn’t want the bickering, he doesn’t want people talking to the press, he doesn’t want people like Marjorie Taylor Greene, who are saying, yeah, we should do something about this, and it’s a bad look to not be in Washington. So, you know, the Democrats show up as much as we possibly can, but we’re really just there to say, hey, we’re ready to go to work. And most of the time, we’re just trying to, you know, stay in touch back in our home districts to do whatever we can to help back at home.
Jen Rubin: I’m amazed that people who go to the trouble of getting elected to Congress don’t want to do their job. They literally have fled. Their attitude is, unless Donald Trump tells us to do something, we’re not going to do it. Have you ever experienced anything like this in all of your years in public service?
Chellie Pingree: Absolutely not. Absolutely not. As I’ve said, we’ve had other shutdowns, and it’s always an expectation that you will be firmly planted in Washington, showing that you’re ready to do your job, even if the leadership can’t come to an agreement. But this is very clear that Speaker Johnson, does not want his Republicans in town, and they’re just not showing up. And the idea that they’re not pushing back, you know, you’ve got a handful who keep saying, you know, I’m gonna show up, or they do show up, but the truth is, they’re not working. And you don’t come to an agreement unless you’re all chatting about it. You know, the other thing is it’s unprecedented to have everything directed by the president. So, you’ve heard a lot of Democrats this week saying, you know, it’s time Donald Trump came back into the country. you know, come back here, and if you’re the only one who can resolve this, well, you should show up and do the job, because if Speaker Johnson just takes his orders from Donald Trump, and that’s what we need to have happen, well, then Simi comes back and does his job.
Jen Rubin: This seems to be a great argument for not electing Republicans who don’t want to do their job that they were elected to do. Thank you as always, Congresswoman. Good luck, and let’s hope that Republicans come to their senses, or that the courts, spare us and, order them to start paying children, seniors, disabled people. So, I’m sure we’ll have you back soon to talk. Thanks so much.
Chellie Pingree: So much, really appreciate your talking about this.
