The rumors are true — Indivisible is launching a third No Kings 3 protest on March 28th. In the wake of Renee Good, Keith Porter, and Alex Pretti’s murders by ICE, we must continue to raise our voices, organize effectively, demand justice, and fight back against the authoritarianism flooding our streets and institutions.
Indivisible Co-founder Ezra Levin unveils what we can expect from March 28th and how we can prepare ourselves with their plethora of resources. The two also break down the Democrats’ opportunity to make real change by organizing against the DHS funding bill, Trump’s false feeling of invincibility, and America’s next steps towards justice.
Ezra Levin is the co-founder and co-executive director of Indivisible, a grassroots organization made up of thousands of group leaders and more than a million members taking regular, iterative, and increasingly complex actions to resist the GOPs agenda, elect local champions, and fight for progressive policies.
Jen Rubin
Hi, this is Jen Rubin, Inter-in-Chief of The Contrarian. We are delighted on Today of All Days to have Ezra Levin, the co-founder of Indivisible, with us. Ezra, welcome back.
Ezra Levin
Great to see you, Jen.
Jen Rubin
You made an announcement at 5 AM. What is it?
Ezra Levin
We’ve got No Kings 3, No Kings 3 spring, March 28th, we’ve got 2 months to build for the largest protest in American history. It will be the largest protest in Twin Cities history as well. I think I can say this with some confidence, because I’ve made that claim twice before, and we’ve met that twice before. Look, I think right now what we’re seeing is a regime that is using the full force of the federal government to try to trample on our rights, and at the same time, we’re seeing normal, everyday people stick up for themselves, organize, and repel. So, I view this as an opportunity for us to bust through this bubble of invincibility and inevitability that they try to project. They want you to think that they’re strong and powerful. And also, it’s not the only opportunity to stand up. We just had 147,000 people register for a ICE observation training two days ago. We’re going to do more of those trainings, we’re gonna do more rapid response, we’re going to do more pressure on Congress to actually hold the line against DHS funding. But as part of the multiplicity of tactics that we’ve got to engage in, one of those needs to be massive. days of protests so that people who have not been involved before do get involved, and we plug them into these other tactics. So, I’m excited, we’re coming back, we’re gonna do it even bigger this time, and I can’t wait.
Jen Rubin
We… We cannot wait, and I know a lot of people figure that, feel that way, and I remember, leaving the No Kings 2 and people asking, what’s the next one? People have come to depend upon you, and, you are coming through, once again, all of the, advisors and I know you have a whole network of sponsors, and of course all of the volunteers. Obviously, you’re gonna have one of the flagship, cities will be in Minneapolis. Have you decided where else, or is that to be determined?
Ezra Levin
I mean, it’s a little TBD, but I think the flagship will be in the Twin Cities. I think it is important. You know, when we think about what these protests have been about, each one, while each one has been bigger than the last, that’s one of the messages, but each one has had a different focus than the last. Back in Hands Off in April, the real focus of that was fracturing the relationship between Elon Musk and Donald Trump. We identified that as an opportunity as Musk was running rampant. in the federal government. No Kings 1 in June was largely about creating a counter-narrative to Trump’s attempt to make himself look like this big, mighty authoritarian with a military birthday parade, so he protested everywhere but DC and think effectively made him look like the puny weakling he is. No Kings 2 was largely in response to the National Guard being mobilized to occupied American cities in LA and elsewhere around the country. No Kings 3 is very clearly going to be focused focused on the havoc that a secret police force in the form of ICE, in the form of CBP, in the form of DHS agents, what they are doing all around the country to terrorize our communities and murder Americans. And while that is happy in many places, nowhere in the country have we seen such an incredible display of organized people power in the Twin Cities. They’re really showing us what national opposition is going to have to look like, so I think it’s very appropriate. that we link arms with the Minnesotans and show what the people of America on this 250th anniversary of the founding of this country really stand for.
Jen Rubin
I want to talk about just that, about this as the quintessential example of community organizing, knitting a community together, labor, businesses, clergy, local government. These people have been working hard for weeks, for months to do this. Talk to us about how this has to be the model for us, and how we need every city to be its own Minneapolis. and the states to be their own Minnesotas, and ultimately to knit that together at a national level.
Ezra Levin
I’m here talking to you, and I love doing that, and it’s so clear to me, in every conversation I have with the folks who are organizing on the ground, I’m nowhere near the leader of this movement. There are thousands upon thousands of people at the local level who are not just now building up these networks, but for years have been building up the grassroots infrastructure. How do we get to Renee Goode’s murder, and then within 48 hours, there are 1,200 protests all around the country? How does that happen at the drop that. How does the country have 147,000 people that sign up for a training on how to observe ice within hours after Alex Preti’s murder? It happens because people have been coming together to organize, and they know how to do it more now than ever before. And so, it is a dark time right now. This regime is engaging in some of the most sadistic scary behavior that I think we’ve ever seen coming out of a federal government. And also, we are so much stronger than we are before. We’ve spent years building up these structures, so you’re right. Gotta be clergy, gotta be teachers, gotta be universities, gotta be people on the ground who are in no way connected to the political ecosystem. This isn’t politics, per se. This is about, are we good neighbors? Are we protecting our community? Do we care about our democracy and what the truth is, or are we going to lay down our rights because some guy with a fascist secret police force is coming at us? And what we’ve heard loud and clear, not just from the Minnesotans, but from people all over, is, no, we’re not going to put up with this, and the leadership is coming from the grassroots level. It’s not coming from the top. And that’s why it’s impactful. That’s why it’s impactful.
Jen Rubin
Absolutely, and we have said that from the start. Politicians do not lead, they follow, and when you have everyone from Martha Stewart to Bruce Spring Singh to the NBA Players Association get into the act, you know you have gone beyond politics. And I also want to talk about just the ripple effect around the country. Our own Tim Dickinson in Portland was covering a massive turnout at the VA there of nurses, other medical professionals. You see people really now… there has something that has shifted fundamentally, as if gears on a car have gone into high gear now. You see that all over the country, a hundred stories, a thousand stories of what is going on.
Ezra Levin
I think that’s real, Jen. I think that’s real. I think we’ve had two inflection points this year, even though we’re 28 days into the year. One was Renee Goode’s murder, which was heinous, and 82% of the American public saw that video of her being murdered, and that changed something. That changed something real, and just thank God for the people who were observing the ICE agents, who were putting themselves in that position, and holding up their phones and So that the world could see and learn and grow and get engaged. And then with Alex Pretty’s murder, I think another thing shifted, which is, it was not just how heinous that murder was, it was also the chilling propaganda and smear campaign that happened immediately after the murder, where you had the upper echelons of the Trump regime coming out and smearing his good name, this ICU nurse, this ICU nurse who works at a VA hospital. And calling him violent, claiming that he’s a terrorist. Saying that before his parents had even found out that he had been murdered. People who were not aligned with Kamala Harris or the Democratic Party, who aren’t particularly political, they’ve got eyes, they’ve got a brain, they can see what happened there, and to combine that basic understanding with what the regime is doing, that broke something for a lot of people. And I’m sorry this is the moment we’re in, but I’m happy that the way millions of people are responding is by saying, well, I guess I’ve got to figure out how to protect my community, and they’re doing it now. That’s exactly what we need.
Jen Rubin
Absolutely. And although it’s not my bag, the Second Amendment community is, riled up as well, because Trump, in fact, has no beliefs. He has no loyalties. It’s all about power and holding power, so he’s throwing them under the bus as well. I want to talk about a difficult subject for much of the community, and that is, we have to welcome our allies in this moment. People who were not with us, who oppose us on fundamental issues, if they are now willing to stand up to this regime, I think we have to make some partnerships of convenience and to, if not welcome them, at least celebrate That they have finally figured out that tyranny comes for them, too.
Ezra Levin
I would welcome them, Jen. I would welcome them. I, you know, I’m from the Deep South, and the, those big megachurches, and some of the smaller churches, they always have a parking spot at the front reserved for people who’ve never been there before. I think that’s got to be the mentality in this moment. We do not have to agree on who the Democratic nominee for president’s gonna be in 28, or what the agenda is going to be in 2029. That’s not the issue in front of us right now. The issue in front of us right now is, do we of an autocracy or democracy, and I am willing to link arms with anybody, anybody who is on the right side of that issue right now, including people we’ve had beef with for quite some time. Chuck Schumer, nobody will accuse me of being his biggest cheerleader, but right now, in this moment, he is unifying the Democratic caucus against the DHS funding bill. Good job, Chuck. Good on you. We’re behind you. If that’s the play, we will back you up. For Republicans who would like to come over, I’m not interested in your press statement. I’m not interested in your strongly worded letters. If you are actually willing to stand up and fight the regime like Adam Kinzinger has done, or Liz Cheney has done, if you are willing to switch over to the side of democracy, you are welcome. We do not have to agree on education policy or tax policy or climate policy to agree on democracy, and I want you as part of this coalition. I think it’s the responsibility of everybody here to welcome those members of their community and not ask. Well, where have you been? Why haven’t you been with us already? No. They’re here, great, let’s get them involved.
Jen Rubin
Absolutely. We’re having a vote, or votes this week in the Senate. What are you asking them to do? Obviously, funding the DHS with that monstrosity that came over from the House is completely, out of the question. What do you want Democrats to ask for, to demand, and to stand behind?
Ezra Levin
Here’s what they need to do. They need to not take a fig leaf from the Republicans and move forward. This is not a time to extend a hand and give them an off-ramp so that you end the conflict. They are losing this conflict right now. The people are against ICE, the people are against Noem, the people are against Miller, the people are against Trump in this fight. Everybody is seeing what’s going on in Minneapolis, everybody can see the writing on the wall that it’s coming for their community. Democrats should press their advantage now. They should press their advantage. And if the Republicans want to shut down the government in order to fund a secret police force that’s killing Americans in the street, that’s the Republicans’ choice, and they can own that. But we do not have to help them solve this problem. We are standing with the American people, and we should be secure in that position. But I will tell you, Jen. A week ago, that’s not where the Democrats were.
Jen Rubin
Exactly.
Ezra Levin
He said the Democrats are not a cult, his word, not a cult, and therefore would not unify against the DHS funding bill. Then the Democrats provide 7 votes, a necessary margin that they needed in order to get the DHS funding bill out of the House and into the Senate. Now, what changed was Alex Pretty’s murder. Changed was Alex Pretty’s murder, and that is horrific. That shouldn’t have changed anything about the political calculus for anybody who has been paying attention to this regime for the last 14 months. We should have been unified before, we should be unified now, but I don’t want to just see them unified in the moment where it’s easiest for them to stand with the people. I want them organizing against this regime this week, and next week, and next month, and straight up through the election. That is ultimately how we’re going to win. So you’re damn right, not one penny for this DHS secret police force that is terrorizing our communities. Hold firm, you got public support for that. Do not somehow fold again when you’re winning the argument in the middle of the fight like you did back last November.
Jen Rubin
Absolutely. There is no shortage of good ideas. Our friends at the Center for American Progress put out a whole list. That’s great. Other people have their lists, but as you say, you cannot let them off easy. I also want to talk about this principle of organizing, which I know comes, just Naturally, like, breathing to you, which is to build on momentum. Bovino is gone from Minneapolis, but now you have to get rid of Noem. And if Noam goes, then you have to get rid of Stephen Miller. It’s not that you wait for some magic day where Donald Trump is finally going to be out of office. You have to get them all. And you know what? Once we start going after them, they start pointing fingers, they start dishing the dirt. Now we’re finding out what Stephen Miller did. Pretty soon we’re gonna find out what Trump did. Talk to us a little bit about the pushing your advantage on all fronts every day against everyone in this regime.
Ezra Levin
I love this question. I think it’s really important because it speaks to… I think there can be a tendency to think of the grassroots or progressive advocates or pro-democracy advocates our coalition as being, well, you should listen to your better angels, do the right thing. And look, that is part of what I’m saying. But I’m also saying this is the politically advantageous thing to do. You can be the most cynical democratic political operative out there. You can give not two wits about your fellow human being and just want to win. And this is still what you should do to fracture the Republican coalition.
Jen Rubin
Yes.
Ezra Levin
If you press your advantage in this moment, they are weak, and they will crumble. We just saw this in Minneapolis. This is why Bovino got sacked, this is why he’s out the door, because they used as much as they could, to try to exact revenge on the Twin Cities, and they were repelled. They were repelled because they are losing the public relations fight, and the thing that we should not do is listen to these claims over the last 24 hours of quote-unquote de-escalation. I think it’s bullshit, Jen. I think it’s absolute bullshit. I see no evidence on the ground that they’re actually de-escalating. What they would want is for media and for Democrats, who have power in this moment, to believe that the problem is over, so now we can cut deals just like it’s politics as usual. Do not give in to that. They are doing nothing really on the ground to change what was happening 48 hours ago. So, Democrats should be acting as if this is a existing and escalating constitutional crisis. Because it is! And so you treat it that way, then you go on offense, both in Congress, but at the state and local level. Now, there is one state in the country that has passed a de-masking ICE law at the statewide level, California. There’s a dozen other Democratic trifectas. Where’s the bill? Introduce it. Pass it. I want to see constraints on DHS. I want to see local and state-level officials protecting their communities. Now’s the time, y’all! Now is the time. You’ve got public support. Show them that Democrats actually fight back. You’re not only gonna do good, you’re gonna win votes, because people are gonna think you actually mean what you say.
Jen Rubin
Absolutely, and this affects every state, every race. You know, folks. The Senate debate, the Democratic primary Senate debate in Illinois was almost all about ICE the other day. That’s what it does. It forces Democrats to go on the record to be the most aggressive they can possibly do, and you know what? Let Republicans defend this. Let Susan Collins, who has ICE, and Border Patrol in her state defend continuing to support DHS? My god! Fine, she wants to vote for it! Let her explain that to the people of Maine when she has to go in front of them.
Ezra Levin
1000% VIN, absolutely.
Jen Rubin
You know, it’s, sometimes we are at the… you know, John McCain had a great saying, of course, it was always darkest, before it gets pitch black, but it actually is darkest, and then you do see the light, and not only you and Leah and the Indivisible, but every person who is doing something, is, that light. And, one of my, heroines, Jane Goodall, would say, we don’t expect you to do everything, but everyone can do something. And that is, boy, do you see that now in action. So, people want to keep up with the latest for No Kings, or they want to do things before No Kings, and I I know you’re going to have actions every day, every week. Where do they go? How do they find out information? And if there’s nothing near them, what do they do?
Ezra Levin
Look, you can go to Indivisible.org for anything Indivisible is doing, but go to NoKings.org to find the trainings that we’re going to be doing. If you miss this training that we had 200,000 people on to observe ice, and you’re like, oh gosh, that’s something I could do, I would like to do it, you can view it on YouTube, we can, you follow us, we link to it, but there will be additional live trainings where you can ask questions live. I think the thing to do is to recognize that while you might not live in the Twin Cities, you might not be into in Maine, or in Chicago, or in LA. Unfortunately, the DHS is the largest federal law enforcement agency in the history of the public, larger than all the other ones combined, and it’s larger than the Ukrainian military. They’re probably coming for a community near you soon, so now is the best time to bone up on what are your rights, and how do you stand up for them when they’re under threat. And even before you do anything else. you should be finding your community. They want you alone in the trade. They want you isolated. That’s how they win. The Twin Cities are showing us how it’s done. Those people are a strong community, networked together, and repelling the fascist attack on their town. It’s inspiring to see, and it’s a model of what’s to come in communities all over the country, I’m sure of it.
Jen Rubin
I… Absolutely, and you can feel it in the air, you can feel it, in the way people are talking, you can even see it in the legacy media, and you can see it in the panic in the eyes of Republicans, you can see it in the sense of Democrats finding their vines and their souls. So, we at the Contrarian are gonna have the most extensive coverage of No Kings we have ever had. We’re gonna be live around the country at multiple sites during the day. We cannot wait for that, and we will be there so that if you can’t be there in person in Minneapolis, you’ll feel like you’re in person there in Minneapolis. And we are looking forward to it. Thank you, Ezra, for making time on this incredibly busy day for you, and for everything you, Indivisible, all the No Kings partners are doing. And I know you joined me in sending, our love, our appreciation to Minneapolis. So thank you once again, and we’ll look forward to talking to you real soon.
Ezra Levin
Always a pleasure, Jim. Thanks.
Jen Rubin
Take care.
